At one of the most difficult times in a family’s life – when a marriage is ending – emotions can run from sadness to anguish to frustration to rage and then finally, hopefully, contentment and peace. Sometimes that range of emotions takes place over years, sometimes just months, but no matter the timeline, a knowledgeable attorney can provide guidance, advice and compassion exactly when it is needed. The success of that time often depends on the abilities of the legal expert you rely on. The outcome of all that time and emotion depends on the relationship you build with the professional you choose to be by your side through it all. That choice matters. And it matters at an incredibly delicate time in your life.
Participants:
Nicole Donoian-Pody Charny Karpousis Altieri & Donoian
Amy Smith Weinberg, Kaplan & Smith
Stephanie Zane Archer & Greiner
Brian Budic Florio Perrucci Steinhardt Cappelli & Tipton
Olivia Mendler Archer & Greiner
Lynda Hinkle The Law Offices of Lynda L. Hinkle
Dawn Kaplan Weinberg, Kaplan & Smith
D. Ryan Nussey Klineburger & Nussey
What people usually don’t know about the divorce process
People usually don’t realize that this is a lengthy process. It’s not going to be completed in one phone call or with one document. There’s a lot of background that needs to be gathered and collected and analyzed to give a realistic picture of what the future is going to look like. You should have an open and honest dialog with your lawyer to know what to expect through the process. It’s not cookie cutter by any stretch of the imagination.
Stephanie Zane
It’s hard for clients to realize they’re not in control anymore. To some extent, they’re putting control in the hands of a judge who they don’t know – a judge may be deciding parts of their life, may be deciding what’s best for their children. That can be really scary. We still see clients saying, “Well, I’m the mom, so I’m going to automatically get more parenting time.” That’s not true.
Amy Smith
Everybody should know that Google is a terrible, terrible lawyer, because it’s going to tell you everything that happens in every state in the country, but not what’s specifically happening here in New Jersey. They should also know they have options, and they should investigate all the different options and decide what’s best for them.
Lynda Hinkle
It’s not one-size-fits-all. Frankly, every divorce is very different. A lot of times, people get background on the divorce process from their family or friends, who tell them what they went through. Just because somebody else had certain things occur during their divorce process, doesn’t mean those things will, or need to, occur during yours.
Brian Budic
There are no winners. This should not be about waging war. If you’re looking for a lawyer who’s going to wage war, and you have children, you have to really think about that goal. Eventually that’s going to trickle down to your kids, and that’s going to impact your relationship with them. The goal shouldn’t be for the divorce lawyers to leave your family worse than how we found you.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
A lot of people don’t realize they’re not always going to get their way. There has to be a lot of give and take in a divorce.
Olivia Mendler
Many times couples believe divorce is always ugly and costly. But it really is up to them how they want to handle their divorce. There are alternatives to litigation.
Dawn Kaplan
When divorce is a good idea
Divorce is always a good idea if you think it is.
Lynda Hinkle
A divorce is a very personal decision that should be made with a person’s core support system, whether it’s family, trusted friends or other trusted members of their inner circle.
Brian Budic
This is what I tell people who have children – and I’ve said this a lot: Look at your marriage and look at your children. Is this the example of the marriage you want your children to emulate? If it’s not, then maybe it’s time to make that change. If it’s fixable, then by all means, fix it. If you wouldn’t want your kids to be in a marriage like yours, then your kids shouldn’t see you in that marriage.
Stephanie Zane
You have to decide on your own if you should file for divorce. You have to decide if you are ready. Once you do, then the question is: Do you need to file a complaint for divorce? If you will have exposure to pay alimony, the complaint for divorce should get filed, because the longer the term of your marriage, the longer the term of your alimony. But if I am representing the recipient, I’m probably not going to run to the courthouse to file the complaint. Instead, I’ll just start the process of moving the case forward and going to mediation. You have to look at each case specifically.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
When your marriage is affecting your quality of life or when it affects your children’s quality of life, it’s time to evaluate the situation.
Olivia Mendler
The first step after deciding to get a divorce
I know everybody wants to read everything on the internet, but it is important to talk to a divorce attorney, at least have a consultation and find out what you need to do. Sometimes, unfortunately, people hide information, so you might want to photocopy things like tax returns. Then when the divorce happens, you already have that information. If we have to chase after it, it only makes the divorce take longer and be more expensive.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
The first thing people should do is see a therapist and get some outside perspective. Then either see a lawyer or tell your spouse, whatever you’re comfortable with. Some individuals going through a divorce get along, so they can go through the process together. Other people are in abusive situations, and they really need to talk to a lawyer first and get a plan together so they are protected.
D. Ryan Nussey
Don’t consult with your friends first – unless it’s to get a recommendation for an attorney. A lot of times we’ll hear, “Well, my friend said this happened in their divorce.” But every divorce is different. You need to consult with a lawyer to hear your options.
Olivia Mendler
Speak to an attorney first. Unless it’s a situation where you and your spouse are completely on the same page. You trust them financially. You trust them regarding the children. At least have a consultation with an attorney to find out your rights. Then you are empowered with what you know. Talk to your spouse after that.
Amy Smith
Questions to ask at an initial consultation
There are a few things you want to know: Do they have knowledge of the law? Do they have an expertise in this specific area of the law? What is the fee arrangement? How much should I expect this case may cost? What is the strategy? How do you generally handle these cases? At the outset, clients should be upfront with what they’re looking to achieve, but they should be asking the lawyer how the lawyer can provide those results at the end of the case.
Brian Budic
The best advice I can give about consultations is don’t be afraid to ask questions. This is not the time to be shy or feel foolish asking a question. Divorce is very personal. No matter the question, ask it.
Dawn Kaplan
I like clients to ask me challenging questions in the beginning, because then I can give them the hard answers they need to hear. That sets the foundation for our relationship going forward. No one can ever say to me in six months, “You never told me.” I make it a practice to be very upfront and very direct from the beginning.
Stephanie Zane
I wish they would ask me how they can save money. Because as much as I like making money, I don’t like making money because I’m spending a lot of time going through things that don’t help the situation. I can save them money if they just say, “Hey, what can I do to make this process cheaper?”
Lynda Hinkle
Consulting with someone in an abusive relationship
First, it’s important to get them to talk to somebody, whether it’s Catholic Charities, Providence House, Project Sarah – any organization that has the resources to help these victims. You can say, “Leave,” and you can say, “You shouldn’t let them do that to you.” But until they feel empowered and they have resources, they can’t leave. I let them know resources are available. That’s the first step.
Amy Smith
We will counsel them on the cycle of domestic violence and inform them of their options for restraining orders. In the cycle of domestic violence, the first-time incident could just be verbal abuse, and the victim stays, they make an excuse. The next time it might be physical abuse, and they stay. It’s this cycle, because after each time, the abuser might bring you flowers, or they might say they love you and it’ll never happen again, but then it happens again. And you believe them the next time, but then it happens again. It’s just this toxic cycle of domestic violence. These cases can be particularly difficult. They keep me up at night.
Olivia Mendler
The conventional wisdom is to tell the person to get out, and that’s valid, but sometimes that’s not the best thing in that moment. Only a person who is being abused knows the right moment to leave. The person being abused has spent probably years working on techniques necessary to avoid triggers and blow-ups. So if someone says they won’t be safe if they leave, believe them. Help them set up whatever it is they need to prepare – put systems in place, opportunities for counseling and financial help – then let them do what they need to do.
Lynda Hinkle
If somebody is in an abusive relationship, you have to get a plan together. Because often, we’re coming in years after the abuse has been underway, and their self-esteem is undermined. They don’t have a lot of confidence in themselves or the process. We can help them feel safe so they can move forward, but that involves having a plan.
D. Ryan Nussey
Benefits of a restraining order
If someone is granted a restraining order, initially, it’s for 10 days, and it prevents the aggressor from having contact with the victim. Then there’s a final restraining order hearing, and in New Jersey, if you get a final restraining order, it’s permanent. It bars the aggressor from ever having contact with the victim again in any form. So the aggressor can’t even give a note to somebody and say, “Here, give this to the victim.” There is no contact. It’s prohibited.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
A restraining order will give certain protections. It can give the victim possession of the home and financial protections. It can give them custody of the children. If a final restraining order is put in place, there are certain punishments that ensue, like a weapons forfeiture, so that gives the victim an added sense of security. It’s also empowering for a victim to have been heard and to have this in place, because it legitimizes the abuse that has been alleged.
Stephanie Zane
How parents can help their kids through a divorce
When you tell your children mom and dad are getting divorced, do it together as a united front, as difficult as that may be. Assure them that these issues are between mom and dad, and have nothing to do with them.
Dawn Kaplan
Amicably co-parent. If your child wants to go to a football game, but it’s your parenting time, let them go to the football game and maybe make up the parenting time later in the week. And don’t disparage the other parent to the children. I also think therapy is a great resource to help children navigate this change in their life.
Olivia Mendler
Your kids don’t want to be involved in your divorce, so don’t involve them. Talk to a therapist who works with children about what is age appropriate to tell them. They can counsel you on how to have your children understand that while mom and dad are getting divorced, this is going to be ok for them. You want your kids to see that yes, my parents got divorced, but they’ve remained friendly.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
Don’t throw things at kids last minute. Just as the divorce is a process, it’s a process for them too, depending upon what age they are. If they’re little, they’re processing it one way. If they’re older, they’re processing in a different way. Learn to meet your kids where they are and recognize they’re going through this too. Even though you’re not divorcing them, it still impacts them.
Stephanie Zane
We have in New Jersey what’s called the Children’s Bill of Rights, which is a list of do’s and don’ts that we believe assist children in adapting to the new norm after a divorce. Some of those are: not disparaging the other parent to the child, fostering the relationship between the other parent and the child, not making derogatory remarks about either the other parent or the other parent’s family. So to the extent we can keep the child out of adult issues, that is in the child’s best interest.
Brian Budic
The best thing parents can do to help their kids during a divorce is not get them involved. Don’t leave papers out. Don’t leave your computer open with the court documents on the screen. Your kids shouldn’t know what is happening.
Amy Smith
Our goal as parents is to raise children into healthy adults who go on to prosper. If you keep that mindset at the forefront of this process, you’ll be successful. We tell people you have to decide to love your children more than you hate your spouse. Sometimes that’s the hardest thing to do.
D. Ryan Nussey
A child’s role in their custody
There’s a statute that says one of the factors a court consider is the child’s preference, but the child’s preference isn’t considered unless the child is of sufficient age and capacity to reason and provide the court with a preference. When a child is older, it’s more likely the judge will not only interview the child but will also give their preference more weight. But some judges are inclined not to interview children, because they don’t want to involve the children in any dispute between their parents.
Brian Budic
We do have the right to ask the judge to interview a child, but judges are very reluctant to do that. They’re not therapists. Would I ever want to put a child on the stand and have a child choose? No. Would I ever want to put a child in a room in front of their parents and ask if they want mom over dad? No. Nor do I ever think a parent should say to an 8-, 9- or 10-year old, “Do you want to live with mom or dad?” That’s inappropriate.
Stephanie Zane
Clients always ask what the magic age is when the judge will talk to a child. There is no magic age. The ages vary judge to judge. But I also tell them when your child is 17 and they’re driving, it’s really hard to control whether that child goes to mom’s or dad’s house.
Amy Smith
This is a big pet peeve of mine. The children are rarely involved in any way. Sometimes a court can speak to children about what they want – usually we’re talking about older children, but not always – but it is less common. In reality, it comes down to how well you are preparing a case to present to a judge. Judges do not like the unreasonable parent. They don’t like the parent who, out of spite, doesn’t say where the doctor’s appointment is, who is nasty, who is sending text messages that are ugly, so don’t do any of those things. Help your lawyer help you by being the reasonable person.
Lynda Hinkle
The field of family law
I love to see people evolve and change and grow from a bad situation. I get to watch that every single day. There’s nothing like being told you have truly made a difference in someone’s life, and their children’s lives.
Dawn Kaplan
The work we do impacts people’s everyday lives, from how often they’re going to see their children to the amount of money they’re going to have. We help them through the process of how this works. And if I have a client who is experiencing domestic violence, we can work them through the process of getting a restraining order and try to help them be safe from someone who is abusing them.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
The person I see at the initial consult is not the person I see at the end of the case. And I think we’re at least partly responsible for getting them to look at things differently. I love seeing a client 1, 2 or 10 years later, and that person was crying in my office but now they’re in such a different place. It’s so rewarding to have been part of that.
Amy Smith
Qualities a family law attorney should have
You have to be patient, you have to listen, you have to know the law. You have to call people back, you have to respond. You have to be organized. You have to know your case. You have to be on time, be punctual, be responsible and be responsive.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
The most important thing your lawyer has to be is someone you can trust. It’s a give-and-take relationship, and people need to remember that your lawyer is not your friend. Your lawyer is a paid professional who is paid to give you advice. It may not always be the advice you want to hear, but it’s the advice you need to hear so you can move forward to the next phase of your life.
Stephanie Zane
Decisions we make during litigation will affect the entire family for the rest of their lives. So you need to be compassionate and have empathy for the fact that while they’re not going to be an intact family, they’re still a family.
Dawn Kaplan
Obviously, diligence and focus are important, but you need empathy. You always have to remember this is somebody going through something very traumatic and overwhelming, and they need my thoughtfulness and care.
D. Ryan Nussey
An attorney has to listen and understand what their client’s goals are, be realistic with their client and give them the realistic options in a case.
Olivia Mendler
New Jersey divorce laws that surprise people
The fact that we are a no-fault state for purposes of getting divorced is something that really surprises people, especially when there’s infidelity. We have people who come in and their spouse is cheating, and we have to explain that you’re not going to get any more or any less in the divorce because of that infidelity, with very limited exceptions. There’s no penalty for the fact that somebody was unfaithful.
Stephanie Zane
Something that surprises people is that New Jersey is an equitable state, which means it’s not always 50/50. For example, if you have equity in a house, and you put more money into the house, you might get a bigger piece of that asset when you divide it.
Olivia Mendler
There are a lot of things people are surprised about when it comes to alimony, because they think if they’re right and their spouse is wrong, they shouldn’t have to pay. But it’s not about morality. A family court judge does not go in there and say they like you better, so you don’t have to pay alimony. They go by the statute.
Lynda Hinkle
Social Media & Divorce
Social media does nothing but hurt situations, because it can be manipulated to present a narrative that wasn’t meant when it was posted. I advise clients all the time: Stop before you post. Stop before you type. Stop before you hit send.
Dawn Kaplan
Don’t talk about your kids on Facebook. Don’t post about the judge. Don’t post about your lawyer. Don’t talk about the other lawyer. Post your food pics, talk about your trip to the park, your yoga positions, all the positive things. Leave it at that.
Lynda Hinkle
First, I would change all passwords to your social media. Second, take a look at privacy settings. There’s no need for a public profile during a divorce. Then, be very considerate of what you’re posting on social media. I counsel all my clients that if they post something on social media, you should be posting it with the understanding that a judge will look at it someday.
Brian Budic
Advice for couples getting married
Marriage is work. I’ve been married over 20 years, and I think it’s important to never stop working with each other. You have to keep having fun together, have hobbies together and find things that interest you. It’s not easy, but it’s worth it.
Amy Smith
You should go into the marriage eyes wide open. Have open and honest communications about children, income, debt, assets – those are awkward conversations for anyone, but If you discuss these issues before the marriage, it’s a lot easier to deal with any issues during the marriage.
Brian Budic
What work has taught them about life
I’ve learned the grass is not always greener. You never know what somebody else’s house is like – what you see on the outside may not be what is happening on the inside.
Stephanie Zane
Working in family law has taught me the importance of dealing with all people with both empathy and compassion. We do not know what someone is going through in their personal life, and individuals involved in family court matters are good people experiencing some of the most difficult times of their lives.
Brian Budic
What I take from this job is to be grateful for the healthy and positive relationships I have in my personal life, with my fiance, my parents and my siblings.
Olivia Mendler
I have really seen that, at the heart of it, everybody wants to be important and cared for and protected. When we are able to provide those basic needs, then people are happy. And when people are happy, they are nice.
Lynda Hinkle
My work makes me appreciate how fortunate I am to have a happy and peaceful marriage and home life, and not take it for granted because I know it is not commonplace.
Nicole Donoian-Pody
